Reasoning Through the Bible
Taking a cue from Paul, Reasoning Through the Bible is an expository style walk through the Scriptures that tells you what the Bible says. Reviewing both Old and New Testament books, as well as topical subjects, the hosts methodically show how Scripture is one cohesive story. Critical Thinking with a little bit of theology and apologetics and you have what this podcast is about. Just like Paul on Mars Hill, Christianity today must address woke, deconstruction, and progressive Christianity, all topics that are addressed if we go purposefully through the Bible. Join Glenn and Steve weekly on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday as they reason with you through the Bible.
Reasoning Through the Bible
S14 || Finding Strength in Weakness || Zechariah 8:9-17 || Session 14 || Verse by Verse Bible Study
What if you could find strength in your weakest moments? Explore this compelling question as we journey through Zechariah 8, where we uncover God's message of hope and encouragement to the Israelites, urging them to persevere in rebuilding the temple. We unlock the profound themes of faith and resilience, drawing parallels between ancient times and today's challenges within the Christian community. Discover how the Apostle Paul's insights on strength in weakness can resonate with our lives today, offering a beacon of encouragement for believers facing trials. By comparing Israel's historical narrative with the contemporary body of believers, we emphasize the universal application of God's principles of blessing and punishment. Stay with us as we passionately explore how these ancient texts remain relevant, urging faithfulness and truth in our ever-changing world.
Hello and welcome to Reasoning Through the Bible. My name's Glenn. I'm here with Steve. We are in the Old Testament, book of Zechariah. We're in the middle of chapter 8. You have your copy of the Word of God open there. We're in the middle of a lesson that God is giving, through the prophet Zechariah, to the people of Israel. They have come to him with a question and he's giving them an amazing prophecy about how to be righteous and what he is going to do. He is taking a people that are at a very low point of discouragement and he's giving them hope and telling them what he's going to do to again bless Jerusalem. Let's go ahead and dive in, Steve, if you could start at Zechariah 8, 9 and read through verse 13.
Speaker 2:Thus says the Lord of hosts let your hands be strong. You are listening in these days to these words from the mouth of the prophets, those who spoke in the day of the foundation of the house of the Lord of hosts was laid to the end that the temple might be built. For before those days there was no wage for man or any wage for animal, and for him who went out or came in there was no peace because of his enemies, and I set all men against one another. But now I will not treat the remnant of this people as in the former days, declares the Lord of hosts, for there will be peace for the seed, the vine will yield its fruit, the land will yield its produce and the heavens will give their due. And I will cause the remnant of this people to inherit all these things. It will come about that just as you were a curse among the nations, o house of Judah and house of Israel, so I will save you that you may become a blessing. Do not fear, let your hands be strong.
Speaker 1:With this. In verse 9, god again starts by reminding them who is speaking. Thus, says the Lord. He's being quite clear who is speaking here and who is giving the message Verse 6 already spoke of in those days. But now in verse 9, god is saying in these days, god is speaking to the people who had started to build a temple but had stopped, and he's telling them be strong. He prefaces the sections of his message by thus, says the Lord. If we just follow the text, he makes us quite clear who he's speaking to and when it is being spoken of.
Speaker 1:He's again reaching out to these people that are quite discouraged because they had come back from Babylonian captivity and their city was in ruins, their temple was in ruins, their lives were in ruins and they were very discouraged people. They had started to rebuild the temple but that work had stalled and they were quite discouraged in the land. He's telling them be encouraged, be strong, finish the work, steve. Can we apply that today? Can we apply that message that we need Christians in the church today who can be strong in the face of discouragement? Because I've met a lot of people that are discouraged. I've been discouraged at times. Here God reaches down to a discouraged people and says be strong. Do we need that message today?
Speaker 2:in the church, those people that are the strong Christians. Those are the ones that many look to, because they have that faith, they have that strength, they have that perseverance. They're the prayer warriors that see the positive things and the positive things that God does, and they give great, great encouragement to others who have a tendency to maybe not be as strong, to be pessimistic of the situations that are going. So, yeah, those that are strong in the faith, those are the ones that are precious and those are the ones that we should look to in times of need.
Speaker 1:We've all known people and perhaps it's been us at times where we've gone through wave after wave of painful things that have happened death and sickness, and job issues and financial issues, and wave after wave of these things, and it seems like some families get hit with more than others. Here God is reaching down to a people that had undergone a great number of these things. I'm sure we have audience members today that are, some of which are under great pains and are discouraged. God says be strong. Now, if we're honest with ourselves, we're weak. How is the question? How can we be strong in the face of discouragement?
Speaker 2:Through faith in God and, as we've mentioned many times before, you build that faith through getting into his word. You find out who he is, what his attributes are, what his characteristics are. You find out what he feels about the ones he loves, what he has done for us. In the New Testament we have Colossians. That tells us all these great characteristics that we get by being in Christ and that we've been taken from the darkness and transferred over into the light. That's where you find encouragement.
Speaker 2:I think is in God's Word, because through that that helps to build your faith. Then, as you transfer that out into your life that you live, then you get encouragement of knowing and seeing God working in your life, where there's a lot of things that happen that people don't attribute to God. That is something, actually, that God does. I think part of the reason is they're lost. They don't know God as their Savior. They don't know God as their Savior. They don't know Jesus as their Savior. There's other people that are Christians, that are believers. They're not close to God and they don't attribute some of these great things that happen in their lives to God.
Speaker 1:Human nature, over and over again, has proven that if we are strong and we have all of our needs met, then we forget about God. God wants us to realize that we are dependent on Him. Therefore, there are times when he brings things into our lives to remind us of the fact that we need Him. And if we but lean on Him and depend on His Word and His Holy Spirit, then we can accomplish His will. The Apostle Paul knew this, the great apostle Paul that did all of the things that he did. He also says this when I am weak, then I am strong. He said that in 2 Corinthians 12.10. When I am weak, then I am strong. Why would he say that? It's because when he's weak, then he's not doing it. God can work through him.
Speaker 1:What happened to the people of Israel as they were wandering in the wilderness? They would get to time after time where they couldn't fix it. But who can fix it? God can come in and bring a miracle. Over and over again. He wants us dependent on him. My Christian friend, just lean into him. He is good and you may be under wave after wave and pile after pile of discouragement, but God is not forgotten, he's not silent and he's not weak, he is strong. If we just lean in him, then he will have blessings for us. I trust that will happen to you today, as we continue to go through this passage in Zechariah 8, remember the hardship they had was they had started to rebuild this temple and had failed.
Speaker 1:Verse 10 speaks of the hardship that was in the land in the days before the temple construction had started. There was no work for men and no work for the animals, which means there was a lot of poverty and there was no peace from the enemies. And if we look at the end of verse 10, it says that God claims all responsibility for what happened in the affairs of men. It says, quote I set all men one against the other unquote. That tends to bother us, steve, I know it bothers me. And I think it cuts against the other. Unquote. That tends to bother us, steve, I know it bothers me and I think it cuts against the grain of human nature. Does it bother us when God says that he is in control of the affairs of men and nations?
Speaker 2:I think it does, but it shouldn't really, because I think what he's really saying here is that I have a purpose In this particular instance. He's really saying here is is that I have a purpose In this particular instance. He had set all men one against another during this time of the temple, the people being taken out, and now they're being brought back again. I think it's for a purpose that he does some of these things, and I think that he's referencing that in this particular point here in verse 10, that he's behind both them being taken out and he's also behind bringing them back again, as he's also giving them encouragement of how the Jerusalem is going to be in the future as well.
Speaker 1:When God says he is in control of all these things, I think it makes many people uncomfortable. I remember in the burning bush when Moses was speaking to God. In the burning bush God said am I not the one who makes the eye blind and the ear deaf? God is not shy about saying that he is in control of all these things and that he is the one who is in control of the affairs of men. He told Job at the end of the book of Job who's the one who sets the boundaries for the nations and who causes these things. God is not shy about saying that he is in control and that when we don't understand things, that he doesn't always come down and invite us into his conference room and ask our opinion. He has a plan and he's working the plan. If we but follow him and lean on him and follow his ways, then blessings will come.
Speaker 1:Verse 11 says God speaks of quote a remnant of his people. He's speaking about the Jews in that context that have returned from Babylon. He is in control of all these things. This remnant in verse 11 is not the same as over in Romans, chapter 11, talking about the believing remnant in a state of grace he's just here speaking about a remnant is merely recognizing that only part of the people came back from Babylon and Assyria to the land. He's saying a remnant has come back. I'm in charge of this, that I'm going to be fair and just. There's going to come a time when I will be there and live. The old men will be there, the old women will be there, the kids will be playing in the street. All the rebellious war will stop. He's the one that's going to bring this about. I think he's just giving a word of comfort throughout this entire passage, wouldn't you agree, steve?
Speaker 2:Yes, he is giving comfort. And as we're sitting here going through this, talking about God being in control and the question you asked me before, I'd much rather God be in control of things than human people to be in control of things, because God seems to have a definite way of working things out for the betterment of us, much different than human nature does, that sometimes wants to control people and have people living in fear. I'd much rather have God in control and be safe and secure and knowing that he's working things out, rather than having to trust on people.
Speaker 1:When we started the book of Zechariah, we mentioned that there were different Christians that, in a good-hearted way, disagreed on whether some of these prophecies were fulfilled in the church age and were therefore symbolic, or whether they were fulfilled either in a literal history of Israel in the past or the future. So the reason why we sometimes stop and cover that is because there are people that struggle with how to apply these. Their amillennial view tends to look at things and apply them all to salvation and the Christian or the church age, and they and the covenant theologians would say that God has no purpose for Israel anymore. These teachers would say that ethnic Israel is no more part of God's plan and have been cut out because of their denial of Jesus Christ. There are others, premillennial and postmillennialists, that would say that God does indeed still have a purpose and a plan for Israel. This is one of the reasons why we stop and talk about these things as we go through. If we look at the clues here in Zechariah 8, we can get some information about how to apply that. If we look at the last half of verse 9, it talks about the temple being started in the past with an eye towards completing it. It says quote in the day that the foundation of the house of the Lord of hosts was laid to the end that it might be built. That's very clearly talking about the people that were alive in Zechariah's day. The language has therefore now changed to the present and verse 9 is speaking of the temple in Zechariah's day. He's talking in verse 10 about the hardships. We mentioned that and we talked about how God's in control of the hardships and he has a plan.
Speaker 1:Verse 11 talks about a remnant of his people. He's speaking about the Jews that had come back from Babylonian captivity. He is not talking about the remnant in the same context as Romans, chapter 11, talking about a subset of the Jewish nation that were actually believing in the Lord, as opposed to those that didn't. Here, the remnant is just a remnant that returned physically from Babylon. As we go through this, we can come to these conclusions. God is saying that he is not going to deal with those that came back from captivity the same way that he dealt with those that went off into captivity in the days of when Babylon came in to punish Israel. Instead, god is going to ensure peace and blessing in the land so that it produces abundantly.
Speaker 1:Verse 13 says just as Israel was formerly a curse, it will now be a blessing. Look at what it says. He says quote I will save you so that you may become a blessing Really. Three times in this section he contrasts the former ways with this new state that he's going to be talking about. This new state that he's going to be talking about Really verse 11, and then verse 13, and again in 14 and 15, three different times he contrasts how Israel as a nation disobeyed in former times. They incurred my wrath, but now they're going to be a blessing Again. Look at verse 13 again. It will come about that just as you were a curse amongst the nations, that's the former times.
Speaker 1:There's no question who he's talking about. Oh, house of Judah and house of Israel. Judah and Israel were formerly under the curse because of their disobedience. He contrasts that. So I will save you that you will become a blessing to the nations. Therefore, he's very clearly making this contrast and he's very clearly talking about Jerusalem and Judah and the nation of Israel how they were formerly disobedient. Now he's going to bless them. There's no real way to make this a symbol of the church age, simply because the church was never formerly under God's wrath. Individual Christians, when we were lost, was under God's wrath, but here he mentioned the remnant that came back that was formerly under God's wrath. The remnant in a Christian sense has never been under God's wrath because they are the believing remnant. So trying to make this fit into a New Testament salvation or a New Testament church age just doesn't fit, mainly because of these three times in this section. It contrasts the former times and the present times and in the middle there is no question who he's talking about, because he mentions Israel, jerusalem and Judah.
Speaker 2:We've talked about that. Zechariah's message to the people in general is one of encouragement. In general is one of encouragement. Zechariah was a contemporary of Haggai and the temple foundation was laid in 536 BC. That was mentioned a few verses ago. That was when the first part of the people exiled came back. Zechariah and Haggai begin in 520 BC, so it's been 16 years since work has stopped on the rebuilding of the temple. If you actually go and look at the first chapter or so of Haggai, god kind of reprimands them because he says you're living in walls of paneled wood whenever the temple is not being rebuilt. Here in Zechariah he continues just to give them this vision of things that are going to happen and how things are going to be in the future.
Speaker 1:Look again at verse 13, just to drive home this point. This is more proof that he's not talking about the church age. He talks specifically in the middle of the verse about Judah and Israel and how Judah and Israel were a curse amongst the nations. Well, the church never was a curse amongst the nations. Now he's in this passage, the rest of this chapter. He's going to say people are going to be coming to you and the church never had people coming to us. We were supposed to go. That was the Great Commission. People won't come to the church unless we go and invite them.
Speaker 1:The analogy is all backwards from the church age and he repeats it two or three times in this section. The only way to really make this fit without changing meaning from the first half of the sentence to the second half of the sentence, is to take it, in a sense of the plain meaning of the language which he's speaking, to ethnic Israel, ethnic Judah. The other thing that happens sometimes, steve, is there's some teachers that try to separate ethnically Judah from Israel. Yeah, there was a separate country, but they try to make a distinction between who are the real Jews quote unquote being Judah and Israel. Well, here he lumps them all together. He speaks of them formerly together and being blessed in the future together. This should take all the foundations from this false teaching that says that there's a distinction between ethnic Judah and ethnic Israel. Am I correct?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and he also has referred to them again as my people. He has all of the nation of Israel all together. That is who he's talking about. As far as my people, he did refer here earlier to Judah, the house of Judah and the house of Israel. That is talking about the divided kingdom, but, as you just pointed out, he does that in order to combine them and unite them back together again. My people, his people, all of the things that he's talking about are talking about the nation of Israel all together, of the Jewish people, of the Hebrew people.
Speaker 1:Let's go ahead and read the next section, starting in verse 14, says this For thus says the Lord of hosts Just as I purposed to do harm to you when your fathers provoked me to wrath, says the Lord of hosts, and I have not relented, so I have again purposed in these days to do good to Jerusalem and to the house of Judah. Do not fear, these are the things which you should do. Speak the truth to one another, judge with truth and judgment for peace in your gates. Also, let none of you devise evil in your heart against another and do not love perjury, for all these are what I hate, declares the Lord. With this, verses 14 and 15 are clear in telling us that it's Jerusalem and Judah are terms that God uses literally in the book of Zechariah During that time when the kings Israel and Judah disobeyed so much that God punished them by bringing them into Babylonian captivity. Verse 15 speaks of the same Jerusalem and Judah as being blessed when God returns to the city. The comparison of the former with the latter means both instances are talking about the nation of Israel and Judah.
Speaker 1:It is illicit to change meanings from the first half of the sentence to the second, in verse 14, the Jewish fathers provoked God to wrath. No one is immune, steve, and this is the lesson that all of us can take away. None of us is immune to the same problem. Everyone, even in the church age, even those of us that are secure in our salvation in Jesus Christ. We should all be careful not to take that for granted and provoke God to wrath. Is it possible that in the church age, we could disobey so much that we would then incur God's punishment?
Speaker 2:Yes, and as mentioned here in 14, the word purposed is used, and then it's also used in 15. The Hebrew word of purpose means to fixing a thought on an object as set to acquire it. The thought of that word is that this is something that God has thoughtfully done and is going to do. It's not just something that he's just all of a sudden come up with and quickly, it's something that has been put into it. The juxtapose is that, just as he had purposed to do harm when the fathers had provoked him to wrath, that he has also purposed to bless them, to do good to Jerusalem, the house of Judah. Jerusalem was in the southern region, kingdom of Judah, and so that's why it's mentioned here in context with Judah.
Speaker 2:And the last part there of 15 says do not fear. God is, I think, conveying in these two verses Glenn, don't provoke me to anger, I don't want to be provoked to anger, I really want to bless you. He can purpose to his wrath because of being provoked, but he can also has a purpose to do blessings and don't fear. That's the thing that he's getting across here.
Speaker 1:I think there are many corners of Christianity that teach and we believe falsely that because Israel as a nation rejected the Lord Jesus Christ, then God permanently cut them off. Now I would agree with them that because they rejected Jesus Christ, god did punish them, but, as we've mentioned in this ministry many times before, god made promises that were totally dependent on him to keep. We have here in this passage in Zechariah 8, one more of a long string of passages where God says even though you disobeyed, I'm going to come and bless you anyway. Look at verses 14 and 15. Again In verse 14, just as I purposed to do harm when your fathers provoked me to wrath, look at verse 15.
Speaker 1:This is nothing new. Over and over and over again, god made a promise to the nation of Israel, the ethnic Jews, and they disobeyed and turned their backs, and God punished them in a series of manners throughout their history. He always comes back and brings them back to the land and blesses them again. I would agree with my amillennialist and preterist friends that God did indeed bring wrath upon the Jewish nation because they rejected the Lord Jesus Christ, the only true Messiah. What I disagree with is that it was permanent and that they're no longer part of God's plan, because that wasn't new. We could spend the next several hours going through all these places where they disobeyed, disbelieved, turned their hearts hard, stopped their ears and God still brought them back and blessed them anyway. Why, steve, why does he continue to do that? Is it because of their goodness or obedience or their disobedience that he will cut them off or bless them?
Speaker 2:No, god's very clear, especially in Ezekiel 36. He does it because of His name, it's because of His promise that he has made to them and it's because of the covenant that he has made with them. I think the most recent example that he's referring to here in 14 and 15 is they provoked His anger and His wrath when they didn't keep the ground fallow for every seven years and he had the 70 years captivity. He said I purpose to do that. I purpose to take you out of the land. I used Assyria and Babylon to do that because you provoked my wrath. But juxtaposed to that is I now have purpose to bring you back and to do good to you is what he says there in 15.
Speaker 2:A question that comes up to mind, glenn, is in our current time frame, israel has come back and reconstituted itself as a nation. The question is did they do that on their own or has God brought them back? That's really the question that's there. If you take the position that God no longer has anything to do with the nation of Israel, what you're really saying is God hasn't brought them back. And as the question is, do you really want to say that?
Speaker 1:Just the mere fact that they still exist. And again, you can't say that they don't, because here in Zechariah 8, he talks of Israel and Judah as one, as being punished together and then being blessed together. Over and over again, the lesson of the Bible Old Testament, new Testament is that God makes these promises and that they're obtained by faith. I would agree that today, god is not blessing the nation Israel simply because they're still largely in disbelief as a nation. They have not accepted Jesus Christ, which is why they're still undergoing all the punishments and trials and tribulations that they are. But that has not changed since Abraham's day and since the day of the judges and since the day of Joshua. When they believed God, he would bless them. When they disbelieved God, he would bring wrath upon them. To teach them a lesson Go do a detailed study on Ezekiel, chapter 36. God says I punished them and was ready to wipe them out, but because of my name, I will bring you back to the land and I will take out your heart of stone and put in a heart of flesh. And he said it is not because of anything that is in you, it is because of what is in me. That's what he says, and that's what he's repeating here in Zechariah, and he repeats it throughout the scriptures. With that, I think, we can learn the lesson for us today which, when he tells them do not fear, then that is a lesson we can take away, steve.
Speaker 1:He gives them words of encouragement and in verses 16 and 17, he tells them speak the truth, judge the truth, judge for peace, do not devise evil, do not love perjury. He says In our day, god is not working through Israel because of their disbelief. He's working through the church. But we are not any different than they. We cannot sit here and be smug and say, oh, I can act any way I want and not suffer the consequences. No, no, he punished Israel, he'll punish the church, he'll punish us as individuals. What should we do? Do what he says here in these passages in Zechariah 8, 16, and 17. Speak the truth, judge the truth, judge for peace and do not devise evil. Am I correct, steve?
Speaker 2:That is correct. Aren't those really going back to a foundation in the Ten Commandments of the things that are talked about there? It's funny how everything kind of comes back to God, giving us direction of how we should live our lives and what we should do in worshiping Him.
Speaker 1:That's all the time we have for today, but we'll be back next time, reasoning through the deep things of the Lord in Zechariah.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much for watching and listening. May God bless you.
